B to Z
Mental health and wellness
B to Z
Tattoo Chronicles: Wild Tales and Wisdom with Derek Billingsley and Kevin Childs
What happens when two tattoo artists, Derek Billingsley and Kevin Childs, recount their wildest experiences in the unpredictable world of tattoo shops? From the absurdity of washing white wall tires in a bikini to the chaos of dealing with unruly clients, this episode promises a rollercoaster of laughter and jaw-dropping tales. Learn how these artists navigated the challenges of their apprenticeships and managed eccentric mentors, all while forging lifelong bonds in a career like no other.
Ever wondered about the ethics of face tattoos or the secret to creating timeless tattoo art? Derek and Kevin candidly discuss their perspectives on these topics, sharing insights gained from years in the industry. They explore the intersection of personal expression and historical influences, highlighting the responsibility artists hold in guiding clients through significant body art decisions. With stories that balance humor and seriousness, discover how these artists maintain originality and balance in a demanding creative field.
Join us as we explore not just the art but the heart of tattooing. The conversation takes an emotional turn as we delve into the support systems that help navigate life’s challenges, including the touching camaraderie among friends and family. As we wrap up, gratitude flows for our guests and listeners, celebrating the mutual inspiration that fuels both creativity and community. Don't miss out on this vibrant tapestry of stories and insights from the world of tattoos.
Hello and welcome wherever you are. Thank you for joining us on the B2Z podcast for part two, episode two of season two, our interview with Derek Billingsley and Kevin Childs. Again thank you for joining us and we hope you enjoy the rest of this episode. As crazy and wild as we were, yeah, and we took a quick break at the BZ Podcast and we're bringing it back in with our two guests, derek Billingsley and Kevin Child and man, I've really liked the episode so far.
Speaker 3:Yeah, the episode's been really good yeah.
Speaker 1:We're going to start wrapping it up with some stories from you guys. Who wants to go first with a good, memorable story from your long career so far? A good, memorable story.
Speaker 4:Yeah.
Speaker 3:What about a bad life? Give me a story about adversity.
Speaker 4:Adversity.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:This guy. That's a deep story.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's way deeper than I was thinking. That's not even the night brand. I started feeling a little fucking eee, and now he just fucking wants to ask me some wild shit.
Speaker 4:Adversity.
Speaker 3:Yeah, some point where you were like fuck, fucking, I can't believe I made it through that shit.
Speaker 2:That's fucking.
Speaker 3:Or fuck you guys.
Speaker 1:Or something totally fun. There could be something totally fun Shit.
Speaker 4:All right, I don't even know what you guys are looking at, what kind of story you want? You want some like just party shit.
Speaker 3:When you're green and you're trying to prove yourself.
Speaker 4:Did you ever have to do anything to prove yourself in the tattoo shop? Well, yeah, dude, I mean, fuck my apprenticeship. But we just got to tell you. Yeah, I mean, there's times I had to walk and get food and if the food was cold I had to walk back and get it again. Yeah, he's not gonna remember he did that. I'm gonna fucking tell him he did.
Speaker 2:Yeah, dude, it was even simple as like, hey, I don't want onions, and if it came with onions you're going back to make it right, like yeah I don't care, whatever, whatever you're going yeah dude, they had me throwing people out of the shop oh 100.
Speaker 2:My mentor was like oh, I don't want to deal with this guy, get him the fuck out of here and I was a hot-headed 18 year old. Next thing, you know, I'm slamming dude's head against the counter, beating up a tweaker in fucking oklahoma city. You know what I mean. It's just like I didn't tell you to beat his ass. You know what I mean. Like, but he was like, handle it so it happened all the time but yeah, like I would fucking.
Speaker 2:They made me wear a bikini in front of the shop I never had to do that.
Speaker 4:Artist rode his carly down from wherever the fuck he was coming from.
Speaker 2:I had to wash his white wall tires, oh shit, in a bikini in front of the shot. I didn't give a fuck, I was. I wanted a tattoo.
Speaker 4:So fucking bad and I hope there's no pictures of that I don't get it I hope it's gotta be. That can't be pretty.
Speaker 2:There's no pictures for sure yeah, no, bro, I was fucking. What did y'all?
Speaker 1:do back then. You know I was fucking eating. Yeah, it was totally different. He's all selling you wanna see those pictures?
Speaker 4:yeah, I don't dude. I mean, yeah, we had all that shit we had to do, man yeah, they suspended. Yeah, we had all that shit we had to do, man, they suspended me. I used to have to pick. I remember too, just having to pick them up Like they're drunk, like hey, where you at.
Speaker 2:Come get me. Yeah, okay, my mentor, right, his wife. At the time she would call hey, where the fuck's Tony at?
Speaker 2:I'd be, at home asleep. Fuck, I don't know. I'd have to go and I wasn't even old enough to get in there, Because in Oklahoma, I think, the strip clubs were 21. I think it was like topless, only it was very like Bible Belt. They weren't crazy at all, right. But you'd go in and I'd be like is Tony here? Tony, have you all seen your way? All the way down you'd end up finding him and he'd be in there doing some wild shit, I'm like get in the fucking car.
Speaker 2:We gotta go. I'm taking my grown-ass mentor home while his wife's calling me looking for me. You know what I mean. Just like this dude was. He was wild, like he would be fucking drunk all the time. I remember we would repaint this dude with everything match right.
Speaker 2:He'd have diamond plate with this color, with that color, then he would paint diamond. Yeah, he would paint this fucking Tahoe that was lowered to match, oh shit, the way he painted the shop. Then I repainted the front of this shop two or three times with this dude and there was a liquor store across the street. This fool would drink like a 30-pack Gee by himself During the day. At night Me and him would be painting the front of the shop. I can't tell you how many fucking times. Yeah, yeah, just fucking mad man.
Speaker 4:You know that's rad, but then he stopped See the neighborhood that I started in over in Fontana. It was off of Palmetto Foothill. You guys know that spot. It's like a real Walmart.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 4:They have shit all the time. I'll tell you the one the girl came. It's fucking crazy. There's this little. I gotta start it like there's this little. So there's this little dude. He was like armenian or something. He owned a smoke shop right next door and the ceilings were all like uh tiled together right so they all connect every bar ceilings yeah, yeah, okay, and at the time I was like the uh, the biggest dude in there, I think at the time I drank a lot little dudes, yeah, just whatever.
Speaker 4:But so, anyways, we're out there drinking because we do that shop and get slow and we fucking get tall cans and just drink in front, just watch what the fuck was going on the parking lot, and so little me need to close this up. But there's, oh, oh, but there was a fucking. There was a uh, uh like a clinic right next door and they had all these little nurses in there, shit. So he snagged one of them and pulled it in there right and they're hanging out. He locks up the shop. We're like, hey, fuck, good for this, dude, you know what I mean. Half hour later, dude, car pulls up, hot stops and it's his wife, shut up, yeah, dude, and kids are in the back seat, gnarly, and she's yelling, banging on the door, her in there, and we're just like watching, watching, and she starts yelling at us she's all where's that motherfucker?
Speaker 4:and I told her I'm like, hey, we're not in this dude like, we're just like that's your business, right? So it's going on for a while, we're just watching. Oh, you're my welcome. Well, the dude opens up the door and he's like you crazy bitch, what are you doing? And and we're like what? She lets it, he lets her in. I'm like what the hell?
Speaker 4:he's her somewhere he's stuffed her somewhere and I don't know how. I don't know if my mentor, this guy, rudy I'm gonna put him on there, rudy martinez, great tattooer but he somehow gets this idea. I don't know if he's done this shit before, but he goes hey, that chick's in the roof. I'm what the fuck are you talking about? I know this game already, dude. So we run to the back of the shop and we stand on this. There's this bookshelf, stand, stand up. Sure enough, dude, this chick's up there, just a bra.
Speaker 1:No shirt.
Speaker 4:And she's perched up like a fucking owl, no way In the ceiling. Yeah, and I look up and she's like looking down and I'm the apprentice who goes get up there.
Speaker 2:What do you mean? Get up? What do you?
Speaker 4:mean get up. What do you mean? Get up there? He's all fuck. So I had to crawl on this little bookshelf thing, hoping the fucking thing didn't cave in, put her on my shoulder and bring her out, sure enough and she sits down and she's right her response? She goes hey, I'm the whore and we go. We know, want a beer. It's like straight up.
Speaker 4:I think she ended up partying the rest of the night. I was opening the shop at like 11. That guy was crazy. I kind of missed that. Dude, I was opening at 11 and his shop was already open. Dude, I'm unlocking the door. I'm probably hungover. I'm unlocking the door and all of a sudden some kid comes flying out of his shop and it starts running. Dude, this motherfucker comes out with a big, big ass Desert Eagle looking thing.
Speaker 2:And he's waving.
Speaker 4:He's like you motherfucker yelling like this and I'm like what? The vice too early for the shit, what? And he fucking looks at me. He's like motherfucker and he gets in his car. It's a Mercedes. It bombs down the street after him. Yeah, shit was like that all the time. I love that. That area was just something that always happened. Yeah, there's something about the thrill of it, it's because they're always put in a certain spot too right, like they're always zoned next to shit, like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah. It attracts it for sure. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there's parts of it where you're like man. That shit was fun, right yeah? Newport had another good one too, there's kids nowadays that are tattooing that have no idea that sounds terrifying to them. They would quit tattooing immediately.
Speaker 4:Oh, for sure, yeah for sure.
Speaker 2:Yeah, oh yeah, fuck. Here's a story, dallas, right, this shop was on the second floor. We were open until midnight. A lot of times 1, 2 am right, busy, busy shop, artistic Encounter. They have a few locations. Actually they had a few locations. I think they're down just in Deep Ellum now one location. But yeah, we're in the shop and this Mexican dude, like obviously heavy gang member type dude, he walks in. He's just like staring at the walls and we're all like what the fuck? And it's like getting late midnight or so, we're like what the fuck is this fool doing? And he just starts saying he's like, oh, I'm about to fuck this place up. We're like, oh, you're about to. What I mean?
Speaker 3:are you all calm like that? So then he walked into the owner of the shop.
Speaker 2:Billy Jack he had his own room, private area.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And he randomly walked into his area saying he was going to fuck his room up.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:So, needless to say, someone gets on the horn has to call the cops. I'm not calling the cops, I'm. I'm going in there and I'm like, hey, dude, you gotta get the fuck out. And he starts to act crazy. So three or four of us end up having to pack this dude out. Right, the cops show up as we're beating this dude's ass and dude was on pc something. Yeah, it was like a fucking wild animal. Couldn't you know what I mean? Literally like what a cradle most of dudes. This dude was just like fucking taking it still get his ass beat yeah anyways, the cops end up showing up grabbing this fool.
Speaker 2:Next thing you know, we're standing on the because I said we're on the second floor. We're standing looking down the balcony and the cops have them on the ground. The cops are having to fuck this dude up because the cops gun, oh my god like this dude just walked in hell-bent a fucking that was gnarly and none of us were down with it. We were like you're doing nothing, no, we're going to fuck you up.
Speaker 2:I don't know what you think this place is, but this wasn't the spot to come in here and act like he said. The same thing to the cops too we'll fuck you guys up too, and then we look down and they're fucking him up. Oh shit, all the time yeah just funny too, and drunk ones.
Speaker 4:I remember in newport a really funny one I had was uh, we were slamming one night, slamming dude shops full, and this little asian dude comes in. He's like I want a tattoo, just being obnoxious, and one of the girls that worked there, she's okay. Because he kept saying, okay, I'll tattoo you. So she draws a big dick on this guy's back, huge right, no big deal with a sharpie. We're all laughing, he's all right, cool, cool. And he fucking takes off. Well. He goes to the bar and I guess start showing people right. So they're laughing at him like you got a dick on your back, you know, and so he comes back, he comes back in.
Speaker 4:He's like, and he's like hey, who did? Who put dick on me? You know what I mean. Like, yeah, like who did this right? And we're laughing like, hey, it's cool because it's a chick anyways yeah, but he was hammered, he was out of his mind right.
Speaker 4:So he's going off. He's yelling and yelling. And finally the owner uh, let's do cream. I worked for cool guy, he trains and shit. So he and he's got a short fuse with that shit. He bolts up to the front right away, grabs this dude, uses his body to get through the front door, pushes him out, and so we all follow right. We all want to see what the fuck's going on. Yeah, so the guy's yelling like no, put dick on my back you know this and that and the guy that cream's been cool.
Speaker 4:He's like just get the fuck out of here, right and uh. So I get next to cream and uh, he starts shoving him and shit and laughing and the guy gets back on the curb. And then I shove him off the curb, gets back on the curb like, hey, dude, just get out of here. You know well, all of a sudden this taxi cab pulls up, stops, leaves his cab in the street, two lane highway, walks over and he's like, why'd you do that to my friend? We're like dude, who the fuck are you? You know, like, who are you? The guy's like, you guys did that to my friend.
Speaker 4:So cream starts shoving him to him to get in his cab. I I'd shove the other guy like, go this way, shit's going, people are grabbing me, grabbing him. It's going well. He gets on. The cab driver, gets on the phone. I'm calling the cops, you guys, you guys are harassing him. Right, it's hilarious. Gets on and you can hear the guy talk. He goes. He goes, yeah, I'm out front of the tattoo shop and these guys are at what? Yeah, yeah, I had a little bit to drink, right? He tells him that. Right, it's hilarious, oh shut up.
Speaker 4:It's hilarious we start dying.
Speaker 2:Well, anyways anyways the cops yeah, the cops go.
Speaker 4:Yeah, dude, it's hilarious, the cab's chilling right there. Cops pull up, they pull down the street a little bit and, uh, asian dude takes off. He runs over there and he shows him his back and from a distance we can see the cops laughing right he turns around the cops are like dude, cracking up, cracking up, and uh, he comes back and they start talking to us what happened?
Speaker 4:oh, blah, blah, blah. Long story, short dude. They cuff up the taxi driver, take him in for a DUI, impound his taxi and all he had to do was mind his own fucking business. You know what I mean? Yeah, but it was pretty awesome. I love that story.
Speaker 2:Now we've got stories going. I've got another one with Dallas, because that was when I was young, right, I was like early 20s. This was back in the day when shop shit was always cracking off, something was happening, somebody was fighting, somebody was partying, whatever. You know, there's something going on, right. So it's one of our good clients, good buddy of ours. Uh, he wrote, he wrote a harley, he wrote a bike, and so he would, uh, come by and just hang out all the time. Well, this was in a big shopping center, right. So at the end of the shopping center there was a some type of club kind of thing, a restaurant, just any and everything you could have thought, you know, think about in our shopping center was there. So this dude, you know, he'd be down at the end getting something on the bike and instead of going out on the street, he would just drive to the shopping center to get to the tattoo shop and come hang out. Well, across the street from the shop was some not so nice apartments, right?
Speaker 2:Wasn't in a good part of Dallas, right, so there was always undesirables walking around, right, yeah, yeah, yeah, right, so there was always undesirables walking around, right, yeah, yeah. And so this one day, dude shit was hilarious, I've never, anyways. So he's, he's at the end of the the shopping center. He starts to make his way down on the bike. He's making his way down on the bike and there's a dude walking in the middle of basically where you're supposed to drive.
Speaker 2:You know there's parking spots there's obvious areas where you're supposed to be driving. And this dude's walking and he's swishing, he's got the purse, he's fucking oh yeah, super flamboyant gay black dude, right, oh yeah. And so my homie's just like fuck you, don't get the fuck out the way. So he revs up, yeah and the dude looks back at him and still swishing, he's like fuck you, motherfucker. Right and my, my homies just got out their army. He loved to scrap, so he immediately said hey, fuck you faggot, like you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Immediately like no big deal Sets the bike down and bro sets the bike down, walks off.
Speaker 4:We're out front of the shop.
Speaker 2:We're talking about hanging out. Everyone's outside. If you're not tapped, like our shop, you hang out. You bullshit, some dude smoke, whatever. Whatever, we're hanging out front. We look down the way and we see homie out there, I'm like oh we already
Speaker 3:know what's going to happen. Don't do it.
Speaker 2:Don't do it to this boy, right bro, as soon as my homie gets off the bike Like shh, shh, shh you know what I mean he immediately was like what's up, dog, what's? Up he lost the game. It was gone and it was like we scrapping. Oh damn, locked in and my homie beat his ass. I told him it was hilarious. I was like the first time. I was like, oh, he's not.
Speaker 4:That could have been a life-changing moment. Right there, hood right, and you were just waiting to see, like you did not want to have to tell your boy you got his ass. Yeah, just wait for it. But it diffused. Yeah, you know. That's the thing about newport that I enjoyed, man, newport was a is a very nice city right. We all been down there. It's really nice. There's a dark part of that town. Man people party and it gets dark down there, dude oh, there's copious amounts of cocaine, everything.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, that's a big part of this copious amounts, dude.
Speaker 4:It's insane factor. Just, I think there was always something that town. There was always something cracking off. Man people would fist, fight and fall through the window of the shop. I remember one time it was my first year out there for fourth of july my, my boss is like you got a beach chrysalis. Yeah, it's like fourth of july cracks, it's like we're gonna go down the peninsula, I'm like it does, though it does, it's wild, it's it's absolutely it's absolutely crazy.
Speaker 4:It's insane it's absolutely crazy. But I remember we're driving, we're riding down, we're pulling up next to the shop and there's a dude just pissing on the door and crim, locks it up, gets off his bike, kicks the dude right in the ass, boom, and he falls, pees all over himself. He's like what the hell man, get the hell out of here. I'm like dude, what the hell? I liked it down there, man, I have a lot of, a lot of good times in that area, man yeah a lot of good times.
Speaker 2:Our bums are calm. Well, it's different now. Right when we were early on, what was the drug of?
Speaker 1:choice it was meth it was speed it was cocaine it was uppers motherfuckers were trying to get froggy.
Speaker 2:Now they're all on fentanyl heroin. They're borderline about to die as they're walking around. They're of no threat to us, you know, yeah, until they are.
Speaker 3:You had a chick trying to talk to me the other day, did you see her?
Speaker 4:She's trying to talk to you. Talk to you.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Trying to chocolate. Yeah, she was, oh shit is she a regular?
Speaker 4:is she a?
Speaker 3:regular around there. Yeah, yeah, okay, okay. Yeah, she's looking for derrick, oh, yeah so what happened? No, she just came and sat by me and I was like I just acted like I was working.
Speaker 4:Did you? Oh, really, you didn't stay there. Oh yeah, no, I don't believe you. No, I didn't stay.
Speaker 3:I don't believe you I stayed there, I stayed there.
Speaker 4:Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, I was chilling. Because that's one thing I noticed about you working with you You'll start talking to a motherfucker and I got to walk away because I'm like Brandon's going to get this motherfucker going and I don't want to hear it. I lean in, you do I lean in? You entertain it. He entertains it. Just so you know I'm right there.
Speaker 3:Just so you know for the hood dudes. There's some dudes that come in and I want you to know, I just want you to know. So I lean in rather than like the dudes that are disrespectful to in cap. In cap is like that's my boy, that's my mentor, so that's like part of me is just like, oh yes, you're acting foolish. Yes, you may, but I lean in rather than lean back, because, reserve Brandon, or or the old brandon, I I struggled with confrontation so I'd either fight you or I just fucking wouldn't deal with it at all.
Speaker 2:So now I just well, you almost you almost enable it, if you don't address it right, if you allow them to act crazy and I just try and treat them as best as possible.
Speaker 4:So you're asking stories, I'm asking you see, I can't, I can't, I can't do that what the main story that we all laugh about?
Speaker 2:right which one, Since he's been here.
Speaker 1:Which one?
Speaker 2:Lars oh Lars.
Speaker 4:I felt bad for you on the Lars story man, that was messed up. I felt bad only because I was like dude. This fool just fucking started here. He doesn't deserve this.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was messed up, so it was like what? Day three maybe?
Speaker 1:First week.
Speaker 2:First week.
Speaker 3:It was first week. And I did you know, this chick called in. She was like, yeah, I want to come down. You know I have my kids. I was like, yeah, if they're cool, fine. I was like they'll have to sit in the lobby.
Speaker 4:They sucked.
Speaker 3:Whatever, they fucking sucked Hood ass. Kids jumping all over the. He called them little bay-based kids.
Speaker 4:They were.
Speaker 3:They were bay-based kids. I kept having to tell the one to go around the other side when they wrote that theme, that was the kids that they were talking about, and you know they were leaning back in the chair, they were doing all this stuff. So she wanted to get her boyfriend's name on her face, right?
Speaker 4:Dude's locked up. Dude's locked up.
Speaker 3:Dude's locked up. I got a brother that's been locked up for 25 years, so I know the gang very, very well, I know that, I know it very well. She's a pawn in his little scheme, like she's, whatever. That's his only little account to the street, whatever Titty pictures, all of that, whatever she's doing.
Speaker 1:Sneaking it in.
Speaker 2:You know putting it, you know putting it.
Speaker 4:You know, yeah, yeah prison wallet he's got, you know, all of that stuff anyways so where was that?
Speaker 3:where was that?
Speaker 4:she came in. She came and got the face tattoo so she came in.
Speaker 3:She's like oh, I want to get my or my man's face or my man's name on my face, and I'm like man you don't want to do that you know, like she looked like somebody who would have already had it. There you go. That's a good way to describe her. She looked like somebody who would have already had something For sure. She's in here referencing blue face and oh, I want to get you know this and that and the other. She didn't just want it.
Speaker 2:She fucking wanted it.
Speaker 3:She wanted it, big dog, and she's getting mad at me because, I'm trying to keep it small on her because I know everybody regrets these things.
Speaker 4:See, I wasn't there for that. I saw the aftermath. I have a daughter.
Speaker 2:It was on a Tuesday, so it was just me and Brandon. She's getting mad at me.
Speaker 3:I'm like you don't want to do that. She's like you're not going just do whatever the fuck she wants. And she's like yeah.
Speaker 2:Who am I to say don't get a fucking FaceTap? I'm like fucking tattoo this, yeah, yeah, she's like she gets all hyped up and I'm like, all right, okay, fuck it.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:I'm like fuck it I.
Speaker 2:You still did it. Tasteful size, I did it. It still wasn't crazy, I did it she wanted it.
Speaker 3:She wanted it on her whole from her sideburns, that was tasteful.
Speaker 4:That was the bottom of her dog. That was not tasteful. That shit was big as fuck she wanted it, fucking big dog. See, I saw the aftermath of it.
Speaker 3:He was like oh, you don't have a sideburn, so it's facing forward.
Speaker 4:Yeah, because the L is facing forward, because the L is only going one way and the R is facing forward. You know what I mean?
Speaker 3:Yeah, so it's facing forward. You can have it on both sides. That's the way Totally. You do it on this side. You know? Yep, that's the proper way I do the tattoo.
Speaker 2:She's fucked up the whole time. For some reason she likes me. I'm like I don't know what I did, but I'm just trying to get her in and try to get her out. Try to close the shop. Give her some money, yeah because she's the type of chick bro honestly normal people I would have been like, hey, will you grab your kid? Yeah, your kid's being mad, disrespectful. She was the type of person that was like it would be a whole fucking Me and him.
Speaker 3:Both were like handle the tattoo Make your money, dog.
Speaker 2:Let's close this bitch up, let's get the fuck in.
Speaker 3:So I do the tattoo, I come back in the next day. All these guys are fucking tattooing, laughing, laughing. And McCharles. What did McCharles say? He said, hey, I had to deal with her.
Speaker 2:No, we all did. Mccharles said did you do a tattoo? Did you do a tattoo? Did you do a?
Speaker 3:tattoo yesterday backwards and I thought To see what you would say. And I was like Nah, I was like I did a name on a face and he was like, well, which way is the face? And I was like this way, the way letters go the right way and he was like okay, good, and I was like because she just came back in giving everybody shit had to say our part Throwing a fit.
Speaker 2:The next day, 100%. She said all my friends have the tattoo and his face in the other. And me and him both looked at her and said well, all your friends have backwards fucking tattoos and it was clean as fuck.
Speaker 4:I even told her I'm like, well, because she looked, she'll look at it and I'm like it's clean.
Speaker 2:She's like I have lettering in the same fucking spot.
Speaker 4:Yo look at mine oh yeah, yeah yeah, Look at mine.
Speaker 3:It says respect and it says loyalty.
Speaker 2:It doesn't say anything else and she was like no, she kept arguing, she kept arguing.
Speaker 3:I'm not from here, no, so she kept arguing.
Speaker 2:And then I said well, that's how lettering goes.
Speaker 4:She's like well, I'm pretty sure it's the same way across the US, we all speak fucking.
Speaker 2:English it doesn't change it took an innocent bystander of one of the clients getting tattooed her friend or mom, whoever it was she took a picture. This lady was an angel. We were fed up. I said my part.
Speaker 4:Everybody went silent over it.
Speaker 1:This chick is fucking retarded.
Speaker 2:I have nothing to do with this, all right. This chick is fucking retarded. I can't. I have nothing to do with this, all right. It was wild, he took a photo and then showed her.
Speaker 4:She was looking at the mirror image, wasn't she? Well, she FaceTimed her dude in prison and the guy was getting mad because it was backwards in the FaceTime.
Speaker 2:You fucking bitch. You know what I mean. Like cast her up.
Speaker 3:She went in there when it finally clicked bro, she goes.
Speaker 2:She goes. Sorry guys, see you later. And just walked out. She didn't just rip into.
Speaker 4:For about a half hour she was like well, I guess it's right and I'm like what the fuck?
Speaker 2:That was the wildest interaction we all said we were so thankful that Brandon did the tattoo because she would have pulled the race card immediately. You white motherfucker, she was that type, she would have fucking flew off the handle.
Speaker 3:She didn't like anybody, she didn't. I felt for you because I think what she, and that was the name Lars, lars, l-a-r-s Lars is what she wanted she wanted Lars Costello. That's why she wanted it big. She wanted Lars Costello. That's wild.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I'd have fucking told her no.
Speaker 3:First week.
Speaker 4:I felt for you on that dude. I was just like I can't believe this dude just starting to have to deal with that shit.
Speaker 2:It didn't sound real when she came in, because I was like I saw him do the tattoo. Is that Lars?
Speaker 4:Yeah, it looked good, it was solid. Yeah, it was solid we're not their dad right, I think you come in.
Speaker 3:You tell me exactly what you want.
Speaker 2:I'm like you know every repercussion.
Speaker 4:See, dude, I still feel like I have some of that old school in me where I don't do that.
Speaker 3:You did say some shit. You were like if somebody were to fucking tattoo my daughter on the face.
Speaker 4:Oh, I'm fucking that shop's going down.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 4:I'm burning that motherfucker down.
Speaker 3:Right. It made me think too. I was like so does that make me bad in this situation? I was like does that make me bad?
Speaker 4:Because no, I think that's everybody's got their own moral on it, but what I'm saying is I still have a little bit of that, you know, only because of how acceptable it is. All these kids are getting their fucking faces tattooed, yeah, and whatever dude parent, I don't give a shit. But I do give a shit a little bit because I'm like dude, you don't even have a sleeve and you want me to tattoo your face. I came up that way, like in the shop I was getting tattooed my uncle's shop, you know, lucky's down san diego. I remember going into him and I didn't have a full sleeve and I'm like hey, do my hand. He's like what the fuck?
Speaker 2:no, dude, you nerd like you need to get some sleeves first. You need to get some body tattoos first before you start getting your hands. That's a total rite of passage, like my mentor gave me the grace. A dog and even tattooing. You can get your hand dude and even then I think.
Speaker 4:I think my uncle would look at me right now and still be like you still don't have enough torso tattoos to have your neck in your hand. That's just how it was. You know what I mean, and so when I see these young kids do that, I mean I could take your money all day long, but it ain't worth it to me. I I, you know. I don't want you to regret that. I don't want you to come back and be like oh, you did this to me. I don't want to deal with that, I don't. I don't want to have a little bit.
Speaker 2:I'm in a tricky situation, cause how can I tell someone anybody you're?
Speaker 4:all blast on your face, yeah it. Third, you try to educate them, try to look out for them.
Speaker 2:they go get it somewhere else and they're coming back to you to fix it, recover it, yeah, so I'd rather. That's fine, they can go somewhere. But it all depends on the scenario. You come in, you're asking about this on your arm, this on your leg, you go down the gamut all of a sudden. What about this on my face?
Speaker 4:fuck off, go think about it yeah, 100, tell me, I want this image.
Speaker 2:boom, boom, boom. Right here you got a decent amount of tattoos. Cool, I'll tattoo your fucking face. I'm not going to tell you, no, I've whip shaded on faces. I've done fucking tattoos on faces. Right, come from the hardcore scene, dude. I had my first face tattoo when I was 18 years old.
Speaker 4:I didn't give a fuck.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know. But hindsight, even still, as you know, in the industry I am it's perfectly acceptable, perfectly fine. There's times where I think about lasering off every single face tattoo just to be able to be just a normal person.
Speaker 4:And honestly, I think that's going to come around, I think that's going to start happening.
Speaker 2:And just being more, I guess, conservative about it. I wish I could just take all the head, my whole head's tattooed all the neck and just fill in the little gaps that I have left.
Speaker 4:I don't have a lot, but the tattoos I do have here would fill it in. I'd be good. I think that's gonna start happening too. I think a lot of people that are doing that shit are gonna do the same thing.
Speaker 2:You're saying maybe a sparrow, just real subtle, like it used to but I was a young kid, I was angry at the world and see, those are the kids.
Speaker 4:I'm not trying to fucking do that too, and I think that's just morality to me.
Speaker 2:I was in a tattoo shop so they were like fuck you.
Speaker 4:Well, yeah, and have these kids earn. I'm like dude. What do you do for work? They're like dude. I work at Chick-fil-A. I'm like what the?
Speaker 2:fuck Yo shit.
Speaker 1:Yeah, dude, that's not a career homie.
Speaker 4:You got a long time dog.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean.
Speaker 4:Like hold out a bit that shit, dude. You better fucking be gone by the time I find it Not going to deal with that shit, dude.
Speaker 3:And I agree, hey Lars.
Speaker 1:Hey.
Speaker 3:I'm the wrong one. At the end of that rainbow.
Speaker 2:You're the wrong one.
Speaker 3:Shit was funny, though. Yeah, that was a fucked up story. Closing out roundups. I do want to mention that these guys just did a killer set of flash collaboration um six sheets six sheets that'll be up for sale real soon here, if you guys we're gonna run some print sets of all that.
Speaker 2:Uh, yeah, just so, because I constantly people are, I have sets of flash. Never done a full set with any other artists before.
Speaker 4:Uh so special.
Speaker 2:Yeah, kevin should feel special Now.
Speaker 4:I felt rusty dog is what I felt. I felt rusty is what I felt.
Speaker 2:A little motivation to get back. You know, there's periods of time where we're we're jaded or we're busy, he's a workhorse.
Speaker 4:I'll fucking pay. It's insane when. I don't want to paint Dude. It's fucking insane.
Speaker 2:I'll paint when I want to paint. I talked about it with the gym. You're building that discipline. Oh yeah, if you're waiting on motivation, you're not going to do fucking shit with your life. If you build a discipline, you'll do what needs to be done, fucking regardless. There's days I don't want to fucking look at a design or paint or do shit. You know what I do. I'm supposed to do right. So he was going through you know creative things because it happens in tattooing and so he got the itch, started doing a couple sheets on his own. Say, you want to split? So split sheets. So we did six sheets together. We're actually starting on another set, right?
Speaker 2:now we're actually working on, or the front of the shop, typical flash setup.
Speaker 4:Uh rose of flash yeah, just make it from all of us how I was brought in.
Speaker 2:If something's on the wall, you better have fucking painted it. If you buy someone else's shit, that shit's for your house, right? Your shit is to help you make money. It's to make it look presentable. It's to say, yeah, everything on the wall is we fucking painted. We're artists. Why aren't you painting?
Speaker 4:Which is honestly dude.
Speaker 2:Really, I don't think I've worked in a shop yet like that I know hb was like that, if you walk into a shop and be like everything on the walls.
Speaker 4:But even still, even looking at his shit on there, sometimes it's a little impressive, right? It's really nice, it's actually impressive. Like when I started looking, I'm like it's fucking impressive and he's right, you know, and I think that's what got me motivated to like it holds a lot of weight with people that don't think it does.
Speaker 2:They can't even fathom what that means. Yeah, you mean hand everything. You want to talk about putting your shop on a top tier level.
Speaker 2:I can only think of a a couple not even a handful, because like that do this, you know they've started mystery one in new york is one of the only shops I know of that has done this, where it is all by the artist. Because, back to what I was saying about the style, right, if you go into a shop and pick something out, whatever that, if that artist didn't do it, it's a watered down version of the real fucking thing. Right, you know what I mean. There's originators and duplicators. Which one do you want?
Speaker 2:so I I'm a firm believer that if you walk into the shop we all got into tattooing to create shit why aren't you creating shit? You know it's the reason for change.
Speaker 3:It's the reason you go to places.
Speaker 2:It's how you develop a style. It's how you figure out color combos. It's how you figure out everything them starting the timetable.
Speaker 3:Now you know they started the five. He's already has another row.
Speaker 2:And I just did the biggest painting I've ever done right before that, if you're in that shop.
Speaker 3:If you're at Breakthrough Tattoo right now and you don't paint a row of flash, your stuff is good. You're going to look a little funny in there.
Speaker 2:But even still, if you're not doing that, look at Ernie. That dude's crushing charcoal little sketches daily.
Speaker 3:He's already thinking he's got an idea of how he's going to lay his flash sheet out. It's inspiring all around.
Speaker 2:Steve's painting again daily.
Speaker 4:It's one of the things you can't argue Ernie's, one I'm very impressed with right now too, very impressed with Ernie right now his charcoal even just his black and gray tattooing. Yeah, it's cool.
Speaker 2:Some people need that motivation, not even the motivation, the discipline. I don't know what it is. It's like a discipline no, of course, but I'm saying it wouldn't have started if other people weren't on that tip but I've been. I don't know how but I've painted this way and tattooed this way my entire career.
Speaker 3:I don't have anything to judge from it too, because I'm coming in and just trying to match the pace.
Speaker 2:I didn't have a barometer of what it was before you guys were betting on how long it was going to take me to do that, two-foot by three-foot dragon.
Speaker 3:I think I did it in half the time.
Speaker 2:The biggest painting I've ever done, which soon to do a lot more of those. I actually want to really take on a lot of the old traditional Japanese dudes who would do it. Chris has actually done a few Really inspiring. I have a decent amount of back pieces that I get to do. I really want to start doing the full painting of the back piece I'm doing Right now.
Speaker 2:I do a full render on the fucking gay iPad. Cool Helps me out. It serves a great purpose but it doesn't hold weight. You know, those things sit in the iPad one day that shit went up in the trash.
Speaker 2:But if I have a collection of all the back pieces, that this is for me. That tattoo cool, I made good money, I helped pay some bills, we had fun with the kiddos, took my wife out, whatever awesome but that painting will live with me and give to my son and that shit will last for fucking ever and it's yeah at the end of the day. What do you want to leave the world like? Your shit's gone. I want my kids to be like look what my dad did. You know what I mean.
Speaker 3:like I remember, uh, I was leaving the shop one day and I was looking at some of the verbiage on some of his paintings, because he uses words in poetry and some of the things, which is funny, because I don't feel to be that way but I guess it is what it is, man. I guess it does.
Speaker 2:I think it comes from reading books and having a. I love history and I think reading history stuff kind of inspires you for sure.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and getting to know him. I felt cool about this. I looked at one of the pieces within the shop and it was like a letter to his mom. His mom passed a year ago and it's been heavy for him. And I came back in and I made sure to bring it up. I was like hey is that for your mom, he's like I don't know and like that. Oh yeah, I do remember it.
Speaker 1:It's just lettering. Yeah, it's a lettering piece.
Speaker 2:It's not even.
Speaker 4:Yeah, it's talking about the one on the corner closest to the walkway. It's a cool piece. It's a cool piece.
Speaker 2:I don't know it just, but they're definitely lethargic. I feel like at that time.
Speaker 3:I think about it, didn't even think about it. It just there's so much information that is brought upon your emotional pieces of art. Yeah, there's so much that goes into deciding to do this piece on this day at this time with the time capsule 100 and uh yeah so when you guys tell me, I don't even think
Speaker 1:about?
Speaker 2:I don't even think about it, I say ah, fuck that but I think that comes from being authentically me and going through what I'm going through, like there's periods of times where things will resonate a certain way and there's certain times where it's like dude, this dude, you can tell he's going.
Speaker 3:And it's not like it's still traditional. But if you know style, he's very style-specific. I would say Kevin too, I know you do. I can still tell Kevin will be a gamut, but you can still, like I said, tone and gray, black and gray.
Speaker 2:It's how you talk, it's how you walk. That resonates, fuck. That resonates in your tattooing. Whether the subject matter is in a specific style or not. You can look at something and be like oh, so-and-so did it. By how he shades. Like I tell people now I don't even know how to shade other than how I shade now Like if I were to try to do another style, it's going to look like I fucking did it traditionally. No, it's just going to look like what I do.
Speaker 3:Yeah, no, it would look weird. Yeah, it would look weird. I'd ask them that all the time. Hey man, if you switch your color palette, how would this work out? It wouldn't. He said it wouldn't work out.
Speaker 2:I don't know. I feel like I could randomly do some random-ass colors and it's still going to look because of how I line rate the detail.
Speaker 3:There's too much that goes into. Maybe it is so refined at this point? Yeah, Because you're dealing with history too. You don't do anything past 1960.
Speaker 2:Well, that's exactly why I use small lines. I used to use bigger lines. That was a trend, right. Everyone was doing this, doing that and it's like the reason you're doing that is because you're looking at a tattoo photo of a 50-year-old fucking tattoo. You're like these fuckers were doing everything with the three and a five. Yeah, there's detailed as fuck. Go look at ben corday, go look at george briquette, go look at uh almond diesel. Look at these dudes that were early tattoos even 1800s 1900s.
Speaker 2:This shit looks like a fucking portrait. Damn near any lines, yeah, but it's immaculate, but it's. It's so resonates that it's traditional yeah that there's no arguing it, so it's like, well, it's just to strip it down and make it dumb as fuck, to make it look true it that doesn't doesn't hold weight. I want my tattoos to look the best possible they can, and that's why I care so much about how they heal serve its age I want them to like look good forever like it's irresponsible at a certain point, depending on how you draw.
Speaker 2:If you draw really simple, you can get away with it, yeah.
Speaker 4:I think you can, I think you can get away with it still. I think a bold line still looks very clean to me.
Speaker 2:I still like a bold line, but he is right. You know what's crazy? That's newer.
Speaker 4:No, no, well, even Japanese. I worked with this guy down in Newport. This guy named Bruce and he and he would fuck. He did really. You know that fool right? Yeah, he's a trip, that dude's a trip. I got some stories of that motherfucker too. Anyways, he was a great artist, and Japanese especially, and he would line everything full sleeves with a three, japanese with a three, and I always tripped on that shit and I'm like dude, what are you doing? Dude, put a five in there, motherfucker put a seven in there, motherfucker and that's what he said.
Speaker 4:He said, dude, because he said, by the time these lines expand, it's gonna look great still you guys asked me on a back piece oh, what size line is that?
Speaker 2:Someone who's a little bit more slow in getting the back done, so two, three years age on it while you're working. Normally I can get backs done six months to a year, depending on as long as the person's you know.
Speaker 4:Consistent.
Speaker 2:Which most people are. I'm very thankful and very lucky in that. But he'll ask me oh, what was I done with? And I'm like it was done with this. And he's like holy fuck. I'm like yeah, yeah, not to mention backs. Expand more than anywhere else the lines get even bigger on the back. So, it's like you know, people ask me like oh.
Speaker 4:I think there's a lot of different factors too, though Are you going to do a bigger line on?
Speaker 2:the back. I'm like fuck, no, I'm going to do the same size line, so it looks the same as every other tattoo.
Speaker 1:No matter what happens?
Speaker 2:Yeah, a fine line tattoo on an older person doesn't work no, younger person, it's got to be big enough, right, you're not?
Speaker 3:doing my three. I run it slow, yeah, you kind of have to, so just do you I run it too.
Speaker 4:I run fast as far as hard my machines are hard right, you're not like that's another thing.
Speaker 2:I do too that I don't know a lot.
Speaker 4:Yes, you know what I think I uh tip of the needle with everything me too, but with everything I do.
Speaker 2:You used to line with a brush paintings uh, back in the day now.
Speaker 4:I'm not lazy now, yeah, I sharpie that shit, but um, because I think that helped me. You know what I remember, I remember, I remember yeah, I remember tattooing when I was tattooing six feet under, I don't know why I started doing that.
Speaker 4:I hang the needle a lot and I remember I hang the needle like a motherfucker dude that's why I spit it, but I run them hard and I run them hard and I remember one time Corey came behind me and he's just like it was like a bold seven, but it looked like a five. He's like how the fuck are you getting that line to look like that? And I'm like I don't know. He's like you're running the tip, huh. And I do with every tattoo. I do, and I think because of that up a little bit longer, yeah, but but then I get, but then I. But then I get frustrated too because I'm like, fuck, this line's not as bold as I want it to be, but I'm also not burying it. You know what I mean. But I have noticed when healing comes around it
Speaker 1:usually heals because it's gonna expand. Well, it's gonna.
Speaker 4:I just don't know any other way, you know?
Speaker 2:I don't know any other way. With the same way with that I I use a tip as well, and it's funny because guys will be interested and you work with people. You fucking are going to steal things here and there. It naturally just happens. Fuck yeah, tattooing is all about stealing shit.
Speaker 4:It happens. I don't give a fuck what anyone says. Dude, All these original designs.
Speaker 2:Dudes will work with me and be like oh what size liner. I tell them and I'm like, oh, you want to try one here, I'll give it to them and I want to hear it. I'll give it to them and they'll do the tattoo whatever they're doing.
Speaker 4:Fuck why do my lines, not look like that Mine's way bolder.
Speaker 2:I'm like, oh, it's because I think they're riding the tube.
Speaker 4:Riding the tube, yeah.
Speaker 3:They're bearing it.
Speaker 2:I'm just barely grazing the skin.
Speaker 3:Yeah, when are you guys headed in your career? What should people come to you to seek? Like I want to go to Derek Billingsley and get what. Well it's obvious, right.
Speaker 4:The traditions.
Speaker 1:Okay.
Speaker 2:I think larger scale stuff right now, honestly. So for a long time you would get people that want back pieces here and there, right, and you do some fucking laborious eight-hour session on this back, right, All the fucking lines, because I draw details, all the lines and you never see that motherfucker again.
Speaker 1:Yeah, because it was so painful.
Speaker 2:It was so traumatizing. It would last all fucking day.
Speaker 1:They would think then every other session from that point on would be that way.
Speaker 3:So you want to do more back pieces.
Speaker 2:Right, so I started working with traditional Japanese dudes and they would do I'm talking like some dudes would do an hour session on the back to four hours tops. Yeah, and ever since I shifted, so now I break up the outline on the back piece to two sessions, you know. So. Then each session is three to four hours.
Speaker 4:That's how anybody can handle three to four hours right?
Speaker 2:so then, I got to where oh shit, I'm completing backs in six months. Then people can not only afford to get tattooed once or twice a month because you're not doing eight hours $1,600 sessions. You're doing a little and so then people are able to continue to chip away.
Speaker 3:It's really so important and it helps so much to where now I really have fun with them of your clientele. It's very important we're still knowing your worth as well, yeah especially right now I want to know where you're headed in, where in your? My career yeah, what's next for you?
Speaker 4:I'm actually not really sure. I feel like I'm at a little bit of a standstill with it. I just want to do good tattoos. Um, I don't know. I feel like I'd like to eventually have my own thing going, where I was able to at least express a little bit more of my art and tattooing. You know what I mean?
Speaker 4:Yeah, I don't know, right now I just I'm just kind of going with the motions man. I just want to do good tattoos. I want to get to. I would like to get a little bit more of a, a wider, more creative. I feel like I'm doing a lot of the same shit right now and don't know if that's because I did something well, and they just keep coming back for that same thing yeah, I think that's what it is.
Speaker 2:You know what I mean. If you want to curate a different approach, start posting different shit if you don't want to do a tattoo. Do not post it, because you will fucking do it if you don't like it, don't post it in the shop.
Speaker 3:The other day we were just kicking shit around. It was man. I want to do more things within this niche. Derek was fucking with him. He's like yeah, you just got to start fucking up all the things that you don't want to do.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah, but he doesn't know what he wants, that right.
Speaker 1:It is a credit to you. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2:Tattoos. So they want that because I've gone through it.
Speaker 3:It becomes a talent, it does it becomes a talent being able to make anything look good, and he's good at it. He uses his color, he uses his black and gray, he's got a lot of tricks. He's got a lot of tricks to the trade, so it's interesting to see. But I've also asked too, like what is it you want to do? Tell him, tell him what you want to do.
Speaker 4:I don't know, you know, tell them, tell them what you want to do. I don't know, you know why? Because I always thought, and even even with derrick starting there, I was like, dude, I kind of want to do some fucking traditional like that, but then every once in a while, dude, I like doing a cool black and like that, that. That, uh, angels, remember the angels that did on the thigh I was like I wouldn't mind doing some of that.
Speaker 4:I so I don't know. Every once in a while I'd like like to get a cool, traditional piece.
Speaker 2:He just doesn't want to do purple and green waves on your fucking elbow. So this is the thing Noted.
Speaker 3:This is the.
Speaker 4:Thing.
Speaker 3:Looking at the cohesive flash of your pieces back, side by side. It's a balance and in order to achieve that balance, it has to match on a technical level and it has to match on design levels color saturation and all of that type of stuff. I think where you're supposed to be. I just would love to see it larger. I would love to see it larger. I would love, love to see a Kevin Childs fucking back piece totally me too.
Speaker 3:They're out there no, no, no, no, no no no, no, no, no, sat down and approached it. Modern day Kevin Childs just fucking going off Like the shit.
Speaker 4:You like man Not listening to you, you know, yeah, I know, yeah, I'd like to see that too. I'd like to see that too. I don't know, man, I got a lot. I'm pulled in a lot of different directions right now, man.
Speaker 2:I'm pulled in a lot of different. Do you think too far ahead or do you just very present?
Speaker 4:Because I feel like.
Speaker 2:I'm very present.
Speaker 4:I'm extremely, very present right now. I think a lot of it, too, is just life. I think I got a lot of life situations. I'm very present.
Speaker 2:And different hobbies that I'm into ahead. You know it changes. I mean, I got a little girl that's getting older and I got a family now too, so it's like there's different wants out of tattooing that you get, because, yeah, there's plenty of years that I was like man, like 30 is people well.
Speaker 3:Well, you know what happens to people ask 40 is they want to own a?
Speaker 4:shop and for years I'm like fuck.
Speaker 2:No, I don't want to do that because I don't want to tarnish something I truly fucking love. I like being able to travel, do my thing, uh, tattoo. I didn't want to lose the love of it I didn't have to have the boss role because I operate a certain way yeah if you show up late. I'm not. I don't. It's hard because tattooing is different. It's supposed to be free for all, but I'm a blue collar fucking dude.
Speaker 4:Oh yeah, you show up on time.
Speaker 3:You're fucking late and so that would be hard to deal with, right, right, yeah yeah.
Speaker 4:Especially in that industry. That would be just like a parent right. I'd be learning in that aspect.
Speaker 2:But I think now I am to the point where it's like back to legacy. I want to leave something to this world.
Speaker 4:I don't want to just be some dude. That, yeah, I think about that. I want to.
Speaker 2:I want to have a shop that is running how I think.
Speaker 4:And it's, and it's, and it's respect, respect, yeah, yeah, yeah, reputable.
Speaker 2:It's treated with respect and the tattoos are going to be top tier. And I think there's a lot of veer off, get sidetracked with life, but I think I want to have something tangible to hold on to. So I think eventually uh yeah, I'm definitely I want to do my own own shop and and I think too, I think I think something like that.
Speaker 4:I feel like now too, to definitely bring out some creativity in yourself. Right, because? It's a passion of your own thing. You know what I mean. It's that passion that this is.
Speaker 2:I got to make sure that this works and it's like I have the dedication and discipline with everything else, like imagine if I was owning a shot that's why we get along so fucking well, this motherfucker he's.
Speaker 4:So yeah, I'm the opposite.
Speaker 2:I'm like fly by the sea in my pants and this fool's like why didn't you draw it?
Speaker 4:yet and I'm like yeah what are you gonna draw?
Speaker 2:yeah, no, it works well you know it definitely works.
Speaker 3:contrast for sure, total contrast. They work in different ways. Kev would work at the shop for a minute. He'd be like fuck this, and then he ended up taking his stuff home. Derek would come in early, he's a.
Speaker 2:He shows up at 10. Yeah, 9, 9.30, 10. Yeah.
Speaker 4:But Well, let's ask you where do you see yourself going?
Speaker 3:Oh, wow. So I see myself developing a style.
Speaker 4:What do you like to do? I think I know what you like to do, but what do you like to do? What do you think? I think you want to go more black and gray. You want to go realism, don't you?
Speaker 3:I really enjoy tones of black and gray Realism. I've been fighting going that route for a long time. That is where I draw best.
Speaker 4:Well, because I notice you'll draw something of a traditional nature, but when you fill it in it's a little bit more saturated, that's my base.
Speaker 3:That's my base. Um, I have a hard time giving it traditional all the time and I'm trying to make it look good, so I resort into the things that I'm good at the tricks, yeah yeah, so I go to my, my realism side. Um, yeah, I need to push it that way, but I don't want to be another fucking peg on the wall, man, I want to have A photocopier.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I want to have a different style. We live in, you know. Upwind, you know, is a mecca of black and gray right now, chicano. Black and gray.
Speaker 4:Pomona, that shit's hitting hard.
Speaker 3:You should get some fucking cold-ass black and gray out here, but it kind of all looks the same. It all looks the same, and no disrespect to those guys out there.
Speaker 4:It's still a hell of great work to put that stuff in there it's great work to put it in there.
Speaker 3:So I can just see myself refining myself, having better business strategies going into the future, unveiling products as far as power supplies and furniture and equipment so you want to get into making shit too?
Speaker 4:huh, you want to.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I would like to provide something for tattooing, since it's provided something for me. You know what I mean. Um, I have a few things that I've been kicking around that, um, I might just pull the trigger on. You know we're doing b to z podcasts. Uh, this is one of the developments and you know it, it goes well. I want to do and it's not necessarily to make a shit ton of money, because I've kind of, I came from money. I don't know if anybody knew that, but I came from money and I have the ability to see the other side, and it really is not that well, I was always told in the beginning that like this is the kind of industry where if you're looking to get rich, yeah, I'm not trying to get rich, yeah, and, and the money?
Speaker 3:well, memories.
Speaker 4:It's one of those things where it's like it's good money, but if you're looking for it, you're gonna find it. It's when you start doing.
Speaker 3:What you need to do is when it comes right in a sense, kind of to say, like your legacy and paintings, this is a painting for me, yeah oh, I get that for sure. This is a painting that will be here in the internet in the cosmos that well, after it's got its code, all of that genetic type you know, it's got it's own little thing yeah and uh.
Speaker 2:I mean, how cool would it be for your kids to be a year long gone and be able to hear their daddy's voice.
Speaker 3:Well, you know, I was on live right now.
Speaker 4:That's super cool, yeah well, that's like paintings right, because long with the people you tattoo on it. But the paintings that you do shit, they press that shit and keep it forever. Yeah, yeah, hey. Show their girl, you know. Show the grandkids I didn't meet you, that don't give a shit like hey, great, great grandpa, you know, painted this realistically, I don't know if I'll be tattooing for forever really yeah that's in your mind, huh yeah, um, just based off of my finances at the the modern, you know the current time right now
Speaker 3:um, I don't know if it's a forever thing for me just because I might be forced to do something different. I knew once I had my last kid that it would push the limitations of tattooing and that's why I'm having my daughter was such a big deal and stuff like that and it's definitely been a lot for me. Like I will, all efforts will always go to this craft and stuff like that, but I don't, I can't let my ego get in the way of progression for things that are bigger than I.
Speaker 4:I think you need to. I think that we all need to understand right now. I think we're all just going through something presently as far as tattooing, but tattooing's never going to go away. I think we're just in a. This is a weird fucking time in tattooing. This is the slowest I've been in 17 years.
Speaker 3:The bills are coming faster than the money.
Speaker 4:But I think that's just a now problem. I don't think that's forever. Like I said, this shit's Tattooing's been around for it ain't going nowhere, dude, it's trippy too.
Speaker 3:I where, dude, it's trippy too. Like I pick my kids up from school and people are like I don't see how you would do it. And I'm like fuck the shut, the fuck up. Don't say that to me, because sometimes, you know, I don't even see how I do it. You know I do it because I fucking work hard.
Speaker 2:You go to in a day and leave with a thousand dollars man, I enjoy I don't tell them that I've
Speaker 2:thought about looking at a different career choice. I've thought about it, right, I right. I look at this and I'm like, okay, I work these hours. This, that the third no way in hell I'm leaving work early. No way in hell I'm taking work off to do this with my kids or with my wife, or this or that right, All that's bad. And all your OTs get taxed out the ass and then it's like I could have made that amount of money in four days, five days what the fuck are we talking about?
Speaker 3:Based my future relying on tattooers? That's why I came to that conclusion, because I've tried hiring people and I've tried to do it in an honorable way, where I'm not these fucking old school owners and poaching everybody's pockets. I was like here, just fucking work and shut the fuck up.
Speaker 4:Well, I mean, that's definitely the stress of owning a business, especially with, I mean it's a business, and then you're also dealing with guys like us. That I mean. I luckily I've had real jobs, dude, and I fucking know how to fucking work.
Speaker 4:But there's a lot of we're wild with restraint, though With restraint, you know what I mean. Like I said, I'm not in my 20s anymore, so I'm a little bit more laid back than I used to be. Temper is a little less than it used to be. But I think that a lot of these kids that do this do it in the same mind state of like guys like us have been doing it for 17 years Like well, I don't want to, I want to have freedom, right, exactly. So I can see the frustration in that and I get that. But uh, I mean, fuck, dude, tattooing is as much as I. I say that some of the magic's a little. It's still got some cool elements to it and that's the thing like.
Speaker 3:That's why I fight to tattoo. You know, like I'm not giving myself an advantage by tattooing right now, 100 like%. Because I choose to tattoo I put myself at a disadvantage financially. I could go get a fucking job and fucking drive a tractor around and do all of that shit and come home. But I truly enjoy being around you guys, drawing fucking, interacting with the clients and hearing the stories, fucking learning new things, seeing point of view, seeing people say stupid shit. Like we still live in a, we work in an environment where a motherfucker will say some funny fuck, that shit, Locker room talk every single day of the day and, honestly, that's where I'm like.
Speaker 2:I've thought about during times of this that the third I've thought about because I can book appointments, I'll do a studio right tattooing is free.
Speaker 3:For one I'm like, ah, then I gotta tell people I'm gay.
Speaker 2:And then for two I'm like man, I just can't. I can't do it. I like the barbershop vibe we're all around a shaved head and every so often like fuck, I want to grow some hair, just like I'll get a haircut, and bullshit with the guys. That's what tattooing I love is my client talking to his client vice versa.
Speaker 3:Even though I can't hear, we're still having these conversations I like it, camaraderie, like, and everybody makes sure everybody's cool. Kevin is one of the busier guys in the shop. If kevin is busy he's kicking down. He's like, hey, man, you take this and for sure. Like that's unheard of in a lot of shops, a lot of people are like don't you fucking touch anything in my you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Don't even look this direction.
Speaker 4:I've always worked with people that are the same way yeah, yeah, I mean I just figure we all got to eat, bro, we're, we're family in that motherfucker. I see these guys more than I see my own family actually. So for me it's like how am I gonna sit there and break bread and this homie's fucking over here like fuck, I am at a tattoo yeah, I always say the best days.
Speaker 4:Fuck that, that's miserable dude. That's miserable dude. And when I got into tattooing dude, I always thought tattooing was a way to collect from people. You know what I mean. Like when I go down to my uncle's shop and get tattooed, I had a majority of a guy tattoo me. But if you wasn't there, well hey, and this guy's artwork is fucking tight. You know what I mean and yeah, I think that's cool. So I like, I like and you know I like to fucking like. I want to see what this dude is going to do in my client. I want to see what this dude is going to do in my client. You know what I mean. Don't go get fucked up somewhere and come back.
Speaker 4:Show me what you can do Cause, then I really be like, then I'll be like dude. No, I think everyone in there should stay happy. You know, everyone should be in there fucking tattooing.
Speaker 2:Well, it just creates an overall good vibe with everybody. If everyone's making money that's a good fucking day.
Speaker 4:That's a good day.
Speaker 2:I'm not stoked if I'm the only one that made money, or you. You know what I mean, like when we all tattoo all day, that's the best day.
Speaker 4:It does feel good, right.
Speaker 2:When everyone's tattooing yeah, I've seen it. Yeah, all over southern california right now one dude's tattooing everyone's hanging around bullshit, consistent, it's really consistent. In our shop, I will say knock on wood, most of us are.
Speaker 3:If you got it, it's the time you got it there's some people that this slow period it's not really affecting you know, I mean they're, they're they're still pretty it is.
Speaker 2:It is to what they're used to. But you're right, totally.
Speaker 3:You know, jim he's consistent the cascals, darla's uh, you know, I know I know some other people that are not, that are heavy hitters as well, but I get it seems to be the individuals that are really interested in their craft and are down for tattooing are our business yeah, we'll see what happens.
Speaker 2:Clients pick that, pick up on that. I do that. You're all in.
Speaker 3:There's a level of fluff to tattooing you know what I mean and it starts with a line with blue eyes. You know what I mean? Like, uh, it starts with fucking caesar. You know that's the fluff side of tattooing. Um, I do fine line, but some of it is the fluff of tattooing. That's to prepare them for the larger things. A lot of the time they're covering that shit up later to receive a dragon from somebody.
Speaker 3:Totally, because they've learned so much more after being in the shop. Tattooing is a developing thing. It's got its own.
Speaker 2:But not being above those little tattoos is what Never above a tattoo 100%, dude, 100%. You know it's got its own, but not being above those little tattoos is what never above a hundred percent so, like dude, a hundred percent makes me think of a point.
Speaker 2:Recently I did a I can't recall what the tattoo actually was right, tiny little tattoo, mom, and I think it was mom and daughter type thing. She just randomly walked in she ended up booking an appointment for a half sleeve right another guy. We did like a what was the car show event? Right? Did a little flash special Guy came in, did a little oh a little panther head.
Speaker 2:I remember this one Little panther head on his leg. I just now am sleeving his entire leg with a framed out sleeve. That if I would have been too cool or booked up, I would have never you would have built that relationship. That would have been gone.
Speaker 3:That's a good way to use Friday the 13th.
Speaker 2:That has always been a day to me that should have been more of a customer appreciation right that you're looking at For sure.
Speaker 2:Paying a ton of money, say you wanted to receive a sleeve and you wanted to go receive something and see the work Friday the 13th would be good. Hey, cheat code. Well, a lot of people think that you charge X amount because other asshole charges X amount. They don't have any idea. They come in on there and they see it's going to be in this range. I could spend $300 and now I'm going to get a tattoo by this guy they have no idea that. I don't charge that much.
Speaker 2:You could have got a cool tattoo on the regular and then we talk and they end up being a client and getting tattooed all the time, tattoo on the regular, and then we talk and then they end up being a client getting tattooed all the time. So, uh, yeah, there. It attracts different types of people and I think that's because we're doing real tattoos for real prices on these friday thirties.
Speaker 1:We're not doing $20 tattoos.
Speaker 2:We're doing a decent amount 100 to 300 tattoos that there's a little bit of skin in the game for the client and they're getting some from us as well, you know. So I think it's a better way to build possible clientele.
Speaker 1:Like you said, most people just don't even know. They don't know, they think you're going to be 400 an hour. Last Friday.
Speaker 3:And stop coming in at 7 o'clock when we close at 8.
Speaker 1:Come in earlier than that man For large.
Speaker 3:You're getting tattooers in a bad state If you come to the shop and the shop closes at 9, 10 or whatever, and you come 15 minutes before talking about you want this. They're checked out mentally.
Speaker 2:They're checked out mentally, they're thinking about getting the kids to bed. They're thinking about dinner for the fam. Maybe they're thinking all these other things it's like job number two.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like tapped into the other aspects because we try and shut this stuff off.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we try and shut it off because it is very well.
Speaker 2:That's honestly when you brought up the whole doing the podcast.
Speaker 3:I'm kind of like I don't know, I didn't say anything. I I'm surprised that we got you on a sunday. Thank you yeah uh, because yeah, I was I don't think I checked out.
Speaker 2:When I'm outside of tattooing, I'm trying to be with the fam. I'm trying to you know I'm I'm just trying to be a good dad and be a good dude and be a good husband and a good friend yeah, all these things and be in the be in the moment, because I've even told him to before.
Speaker 4:I think I've said, hey, man, let's go, because you know, we know some similar people in the industry and then some we don't, and I've checked them out, like, oh, I guess, fuck cool, we go challenge right around the corner, go check them out. I tell them let's go. There's a oh fuck, go over. Like I'm done. I clocked off. I'm going home, I'm going to sing with my family Like fuck, you're right, okay, well, all right, cool.
Speaker 2:But then you're the same way in a lot of elements as well.
Speaker 3:Even the contrast between all the individuals in the shop, we all have the same commonality of treating people good, 100%.
Speaker 2:I will say that's a big part being good fathers.
Speaker 4:I think our shop yeah, I think I will say I've worked in a few places and that shop.
Speaker 2:We're always a delinquent. Every shop except for ours.
Speaker 4:Yeah, we don't have one. We don't have one, not one, that's creeping on girls. No, we all mesh extremely well, not one that's got a drug issue.
Speaker 2:Yeah, not one that yeah fathers.
Speaker 4:That's where I feel like we're like the time, we're like this kind of but even steven ernie are, and with them I just think. I just think we all are very, but they're down to earth, bro, you don't need yeah, because I'm sitting down there, because I've worked in shops with guys I worked in shops with guys. They're like we're, they're tattooed. It's over eccentric, yeah like we get it.
Speaker 2:Homie, we get it.
Speaker 4:You're a fucking tattooer, I get it like these guys are just down to earth. You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:I have a painting in my house I see every day this dude did years ago and it's such a good concert reminder and it's just a little flash painting. It's literally just banners and I think there's a tattoo machine on it and it just says get off your high horse, You're just a tattooer.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I see, consciously, it's just like I'm nobody special. As long as I'm special to my wife and my kids, I hit the lottery. As long as my friends, like, respect what I, you know, think and say and you know, that's what matters. The rest of it it's for the birds and that's why, back to what I was saying, I was kind of iffy about doing because I love tattooing. There's shitty parts of it, there's good parts of it, but like it deserves a certain level of respect that most of these tattoos podcasts are not fucking giving 100 they're trying to be.
Speaker 2:Oh, I'm a artsy, fartsy savant. It's like dude, we're just tattooers, yeah yeah you provide a service, you tattoo. It's a trade I could teach anyone who doesn't know how to draw to do a clean, well-applied tattoo yeah, are you going? To be better if you're artistic and you have a little bit of design, uh, ideas and things of course but I've seen a million and one tattooers you can't draw starting out by the end of their career. They're drawing shit on the skin, fucking blowing your fucking mind, yeah, yeah because of repetition.
Speaker 2:It's a trade you can teach somebody well, you can teach somebody how to tattoo, so when they're like, I don't even know if this is the same, but I've even.
Speaker 4:I was gonna say that I don't even know if it applies. But yeah, people ask me like, what do you do? I never am I, I'm a tattooer. I'm always like I'm a tattooer, me too. Yeah, I don't think I've ever once said I'm a tattoo artist, I'm a tattoo you're trying to church up something that doesn't need churching up, it's I mean look at me, dude, I'm not trying to church shit up, right exactly, I'm a tattooer, bro. Half the people.
Speaker 2:It all depends on how you approach. Sick tats, bro. I don't tattoo, I just get tats.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, that's not the client. Yeah, yeah, but if you're like, oh, bro, you got a really nice tattoo.
Speaker 2:Oh, yeah, I tattoo. Here's a card man Cause I know that you're going to come with it A certain level of respect that you're you're kind of serious, yeah, but only 35 ideas you have that you're never going to get and they're not in my style, I promise you.
Speaker 3:I just you know. Thank you for taking the time out. Yeah, of course, guys. I know you guys are very busy to do this.
Speaker 4:No man, thank you, I'm kind of stuck I never noticed before.
Speaker 3:They're fun. No, it's cool, yeah.
Speaker 4:I'm almost like dude. Let's crack another one.
Speaker 2:Let's keep just bullshitting. Yeah, well, that's what I was saying. Uh, you know, when you, you were possibly asking, you know, oh, subjects or this or that, what's, what's this, what's that? I'm like, honestly, I don't want any of it, I just whatever comes out, comes out, like you know, this podcast could be about this and then next time you do it it could be that's podcast. I mean, I'm an avid actual podcast listener, a handful that I regularly listen to. Those are the best ones, the ones that are natural, they're not forced, they don't have a fucking script. Hey, what about this? What about that? Like things that just seem to come naturally are the best podcasts. You know what I mean. Like they hold the most weight. Way you get the best stories. You get the realness like you were talking about. You know, people have come to tears with certain things.
Speaker 3:That only happens through, through natural, uh, conversations with with men, you know well, you got to say yes too, and I appreciate you guys, of course, saying yes and opening your home 100.
Speaker 4:Yeah, thank you, of course, of course the missus, you know.
Speaker 3:Uh, with all the yeah, she hooked it up she hooked it up.
Speaker 4:She's a good woman, dude she hooked it up she's a good woman, man. She was all pumped when she heard you guys had come over.
Speaker 3:She was like I gotta feed them yeah, I wanna wish you guys much prosperity within the history of tattooing and in your futures and endeavors. I wanna wish you guys happy, health and wealth to your families. I know you guys are fucking very active fathers and it's a joy to watch. I appreciate working with you guys. I'll see you guys. Fucking what Tuesday you won't see me.
Speaker 2:I'll be editing this bitch.
Speaker 3:I'll be playing surgeries on Tuesday when you back.
Speaker 2:I'll be there Wednesday. Basically, tuesday is surgery day, a whole day at the hospital with the baby.
Speaker 3:Wednesday I have appointments the rest of the week. Go ahead, bring him in. What's he getting real?
Speaker 2:quick. He has a condition. He has what's called craniosynosis. Basically, skulls have soft spots, yep, the rear one fused together. I mean I think it was fused together when it was born, you know. So it doesn't have the back of its head, doesn't have the ability to continue to expand, to let the brain grow. It's perfectly no eye obstruction. Nothing bad is happening yet, nor would they. They don't know necessarily that anything bad would happen, but if you don't do something, and then it does, you're harming your baby.
Speaker 4:You don't really have a choice you're harming your baby.
Speaker 2:You don't really have a choice. It's not, not ideal. They basically have to cut him open from ear to ear, cross his head and and basically add a soft spot.
Speaker 1:Essentially a big old handsome guy you showed me.
Speaker 2:Yeah so he's going to have a big scar on his head. It's been like I said something we've known about for a long time, but it's here. I took him on Wednesday of last week, had to do the pre-op get his blood work done. That's the worst man having to hold your baby down so they can stick a needle in him and him scream. It's like dude.
Speaker 4:I wish he could just cut my head open, right, we all do, yeah, we all feel that same way 100%. I think you and I talked about it too I would do, leave my boy alone.
Speaker 2:We don't have that option, for whatever reason. It's fairly common with boys. Loma Linda is supposed to be the best hospital in the country for that type of stuff. He's in good hands, been praying about it nonstop, but it's definitely going to be heavy. And as a father it's even heavier Because I have a mother-in-law, a father-in-law, a wife, two girls looking at me.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, and I can looking at me, oh yeah, and I can't fucking cry. Right, I may be able to shed a tear, but I gotta be strong.
Speaker 2:You got a whole strong, all of them, yeah, you know, so that they're able to do whatever they need to do. But they need to be able to see me being strong for the family and handling business and doing what's necessary. So for me that's an added challenge because in my hearts of hearts, I want to fucking break down and cry for this dude because, like, yeah, I don't want him anywhere near, I don't want him to get a shot ever again in his fucking life, right, but now I'm having to give him to this doctor to cut his head. It's fucking gnarly, right, but yeah. So tuesday he's got to have this surgery. Uh, he'll be in the hospital three or four days. Luckily, my wife's able to uh, you know, be with him full time. She's getting paid time off.
Speaker 2:She saved it for this, uh shout out to the moms out there holding it down wifey's the best you know thing that's ever happened to me, for sure, and for I tell the kids all the time I said you guys hit the lotto with the mom and the grandma, because my mother-in-law is a freaking angel too. She stepped up when my mom died. She's she's basically my mom, you know. So, uh, yeah, they're holding it down, so she's going to be there as appointments I I have. I'm going to go handle business, cause I we got to make money, that's right, doing the tattoos, and then I'll go, you know, up to the hospital, chill with the baby, with the wifey, bring food, whatever, just spend time. And then they only allow one parent to stay. So either me or her we'll stay the night with the baby and We'll be good. Honestly, I'm ready to get it done, because it's been a cloud kind of hanging over you know you're going to have to do it. I'm very much like fucking handle it. Let's get it done. Let's knock this shit out.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah, it's just how I handle life.
Speaker 2:Give me the bad news first. You know, yep, so I'm ready to get that past us. He'll be doing better in no time. We in Halloween and he'll have a scar on his head and he'll probably have to throw some fists as a kid, as a chip on his shoulder, because they'll fuck with him.
Speaker 4:That's right, that's fine. No, no, no, kids, bounce back so quick, though he's gonna bounce back so fast.
Speaker 2:You know how it is kids are gonna make funny for anything and everything possible, so he'll have to scrap as a dad.
Speaker 3:You look at all we try to leave no stone unturned.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so we're going to handle that and he'll be a good dude and everything's normal.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, like you said, everything's fine, it's more or less cosmetic.
Speaker 2:It is preventative for possible issues with the brain growth, so there's no debate about hey we got to fucking do it. It is what it is.
Speaker 3:Well, we're going to wish you the best and definitely pray for you on that one. Yeah, I appreciate that. Yeah, thank you guys. You know the shot feels it and you know we're all watching If there's anything you need man, you already know yeah, 100%, and that's.
Speaker 2:He knows that I'm not the most talkative always, but that's reciprocated across the board. Yeah, I got everybody.
Speaker 1:You want to? Yeah, I appreciate it. Thank you for sharing that. Yeah, just you know once again, guys.
Speaker 3:Thank you from B to Z. This is Brandon, and I want to thank Kevin Childs and Derek Billingsley for coming in Tomas.
Speaker 4:thank you again. Thank you, dude. I appreciate it guys. Thank you guys.
Speaker 3:I love this stuff, guys. I'm always inspired by what it is that I hear through these things. It stimulates my brain in a different way. I think about these things a lot, so hopefully you guys are enjoying listening and thank you for tuning in to B2Z Podcast. Thank you.
